Steering Group Online Meeting Notes - 8th December 2025
Chair - Edward Baker
Attendees
Jeremy Percy, John Balls, Nicola White, Martin Yorwarth, Adrian Bartlett, Richard Stride, Morven Robertson, Emma Plotnek
Meeting notes
An un-edited transcript of the meeting is provided at the bottom of this note.
• We agreed that we would seek funding to employ someone on a short-term basis to assist with the set-up of the network. Specifically, we need someone who can work with all those who have signed up to take part in the development of the network to properly define its structure and governance.
We agreed to send out a survey for everyone to complete to help us understand how the network can work best for you.
Small Scale Inshore Network Membership Structure Questions – Fill in form
• We agreed we need the help of someone who has an in depth and balanced understanding of the fishing industry as well experience setting up / working in community organisations to help us create the network.
• Our intention is that this person will get the network to a point where a longer-term appointment can be made.
• The existing temporary steering group will then stand-down and allow the members to vote on a new steering group / committee, once we properly understand the best structure to use.
Transcript
8 December 2025, 04:04pm
Edward Baker started transcription
Morven Robertson 0:03
Lead on everything that we fund that has to do with marine and fisheries and I think as most of you might know as me has been funding some of this work already. So we've been supporting some of the.
Richard Stride 0:08
Yeah.
Martin Yorwarth 0:16
Thanks.
Morven Robertson 0:18
Like the event that some of you might have come to, I think that was held in February in London that brought together fishers to kind of start talking about what a network could be, what the value of it might be and how it could work. And then we've been supporting you add with some funding to kind of facilitate and coordinate the group already and then supporting.
Martin Yorwarth 0:33
Yeah.
Aye.
Morven Robertson 0:38
The website that's just launched to kind of come up and be live, so we're very keen to kind of continue supporting this work. I think I was really keen and I chatted to add just to have a bit of a touch base before Christmas to understand.
Richard Stride 0:45
Yeah.
Martin Yorwarth 0:46
Yes.
Richard Stride 0:53
Yeah.
Morven Robertson 0:53
You know how things are going, how people are feeling now that the network is up and I guess kind of formally running in some sense of the word just to get an idea of what 2026 might look like. And so I guess.
To kind of.
You know from our perspective, Ed may have said, but I think it's probably like 10 years ago we supported farmers who also wanted their own voice to establish the nature friendly farming network and we supported them to hire their own coordinator. That worked.
Richard Stride 1:12
OK.
Yeah.
Martin Yorwarth 1:29
Aye.
Morven Robertson 1:30
For the nature friendly farming network, but was housed and paid for and managed within RSPBI, think for about 5 years and then the nature friendly farming network became its own entity and it now hires about 16 people as we still fund it in part. But there are lots of other funders who fund it.
Martin Yorwarth 1:48
Yeah.
Morven Robertson 1:49
And that has grown into a really successful network that serves farmers needs all over England and they have someone who works for them in Westminster advocating on their behalf and pushing for policy change, but also kind of working with farmers on the ground all over England. So I think Esme has always been, really.
Richard Stride 1:57
Yeah.
Martin Yorwarth 1:58
Yeah.
Yeah.
Richard Stride 2:00
Yeah.
Morven Robertson 2:08
Interested in how can this model work? Could it work in the fishing sector? What would that look like? You know, is that appetite for that? So that's kind of why we've been supporting this and trying to listen, I guess, to the clear messages that I feel have come out from some of the small scale fisheries work that you've all been involved in over the last year around.
Small scale and ensure fishermen don't feel that they have a voice. They want better kind of campaigning and advocacy opportunities and maybe a network would be a good idea. So to be honest I'm just really keen to hear today whether you feel having some dedicated specific support would be used.
Useful. What would that look like? Is that a coordinator? Is that an administrator? If and what else would you need some budget for other things to do different things over the next year or eighteen months? And then I think I would welcome a strategic discussion about.
Martin Yorwarth 2:59
Yeah.
Morven Robertson 3:05
Where that person or people would best sit, you know, would because obviously the network is not an organisation, so we can't give funding as a foundation to individuals. It will have to go to a constituted organisation. So just figuring out where that person best sits.
Martin Yorwarth 3:19
Oh.
Morven Robertson 3:24
And making sure that whatever organisation it sits within, fishers and others involved in the network are going to be comfortable with that and that it's, I guess from my perspective thinking about that in a savvy way around which organisation do we choose that's going to be seen, I guess by others as neutral and representative.
Of everyone, if that makes sense and not be politicised. So I'm going to shut up. I hope that all made sense, but I'm really happy to answer any questions as to like why as me as keen on this work. But I think really just for me, I'm doing my budget planning for next year and I'd really love to get some budget into my pipeline to say we think we're going to.
Martin Yorwarth 3:45
Yeah.
Morven Robertson 4:03
To explore supporting a coordinator, so that's the first thing and secondly, getting your views on where you think that coordinator would best fit and sit and whether it's a coordinator or something completely different, you want funding for. So yeah, I hope that's clear.
Edward Baker 4:19
Thanks Morgan. Has anyone anyone got any initial responses? Perhaps first on whether or not there's a need for a coordinator?
Adrian Bartlett 4:34
Yeah.
Martin Yorwarth 4:36
Yeah.
Adrian Bartlett 4:37
I think we do need somebody more than to maybe steer it through next year because obviously Ed's tied up with the pfsa so much, isn't he? And I think since we started this little small scale network, it's we've been trying to do it on part time in.
And from the outside in with everybody trying to do little bits at times. But I think to, you know, with the kind of meetings that we've had, I think a coordinator or somebody titled that I think to move this forward for next year, we're going to need somebody at least.
Part time to to concentrate on it to to drive it forward for the next stages, really to obviously talk to people you know, because Ed can only do so much, can't he? So I think we do need somebody that can drive it forward in 2026.
Morven Robertson 5:21
Yeah.
Adrian Bartlett 5:33
If it's a short term.
Coordinator for six, eight months, four to six months. If it's an interim coordinator until the right person comes along, we do know that the person that needs to have some sort of knowledge of the fishing industry, the people.
The catching sector, the selling sector, you know, like with Martin is talking to him the other day it was. He was really interesting to listen to, to, to set that network up in a very short period of time. So you need a Martin lions within this organisation. That's not scared to knock on doors.
Morven Robertson 5:53
Yeah.
Adrian Bartlett 6:11
And to drive it forward so that that's my thoughts more.
Morven Robertson 6:15
Yeah. OK. Thank you. I'm just taking notes while we chat. Richard, did you have your hand up? Yeah. Sorry, Ed, you you do this best.
Edward Baker 6:19
Thanks, Heidi.
Richard Stride 6:22
I I did, yeah. But. But Adrian's very well covered it, you know, he's exactly right. None of us has got enough time or a complete set of skills to to do this. I think it is important, as you said, that it whatever arrangement.
Edward Baker 6:23
Yeah. Go on, Richard.
Morven Robertson 6:27
From.
Richard Stride 6:39
We make to host a coordinator or to sport. A coordinator will be important and also who the coordinator is. It seems some of my fishing colleagues are extraordinarily sensitive to who is involved in these things.
Morven Robertson 6:42
Yeah.
Richard Stride 6:55
And so he wants to be someone who can, you know, who is acceptable to everybody.
Morven Robertson 7:02
Yeah, definitely. I think finding that person will be the challenge potentially. So it's kind of thinking about is there someone in mind or do do an open recruitment. And yeah, I think that's also why I'm keen to understand where, which organisation does that person best fit to ruffle the least feathers as well, you know, so.
But thank you. Yeah, John. And then Emma, I think or Emma, maybe you're first. Sorry, Emma. Yeah.
Emma Plotnek 7:26
John's welcome to go first if he wants to. Sorry, I'm making a also making a cheese sandwich. So yeah, I think having a coordinator is vital because just like from witnessing what happens in the fishing industry, it's so hard for, like, the people who are out fishing to have.
Morven Robertson 7:29
So.
Emma Plotnek 7:44
The same like the time and also like the same skill. Sorry, the same skill set of people that do the kind of work of coordinating and organising. So I think having that person is critical. I think I'd like.
Probably want to be like, don't go too fast. I know there is a like an excitement and an urgency around this, but I think getting it right is just going to be vital. I was sent to Ed the other day. Like if if you put the wrong coordinator in and that person doesn't.
Morven Robertson 8:02
Yeah.
Emma Plotnek 8:16
Build or have trust with the industry and like, know how to really well manage like lots of different like probably sometimes conflicting interests with fishermen. It's like this is like this could potentially tank and that would be so sad. So I think choosing the right person is really important.
In terms of, I'm just going to give you an update because there had been a few whisperings of like wood fishing into the future be able to host that position. I like. I completely understand what RSPB did, but I think in terms of RSPB probably having a lot more like.
Administrative support then, like we do as a small organisation, I don't think fishing into the future would be the right place for someone just because if we had to like employ another person within fishing into the future, it would mean like that I would have to make a new contract and that's just yeah. It's like a lot of of work and I'm not.
Morven Robertson 8:53
Oh.
Yeah.
Emma Plotnek 9:11
Not sure it would be the right place for them, but I said add and I'd like to like reiterate this, you need like a committee of people to manage that coordinator and guide that coordinator and be on the panel. That's like helping to interview them and stuff. I think like that'd be a really good place for us to sit and I'd be really happy to offer that up.
In terms of support from us, I just kind of feel like because we're not a fishing, we don't represent fishermen, we're probably not like, even even like, I'm just taking it gentle with being part of this network because I know I don't represent fishermen and I don't want to dilute any voices so.
Morven Robertson 9:47
No.
Emma Plotnek 9:49
You have our support, but it's where you're like, telling me to be involved. I think or like where the fishermen on this call are telling me that we're useful to be involved.
Morven Robertson 9:57
Yeah, yeah. And I totally hear the kind of, you know, as me, it's not in a rush either. We don't need to hire somebody or get this moving if it's not needed right now, I think I'm just conscious of if we don't get dedicated resource and then it lands kind of back on people who are.
Picking it up now and they don't have capacity necessarily. So yeah, it's whether that coordinator is outward facing or inward facing. You kind of need someone to do some of the work now, yeah.
Jeremy Percy 10:18
Yeah.
Morven Robertson 10:28
Hi, Jerry.
Jeremy Percy 10:30
Hi, guys. Yeah. Sorry I'm late. So I got tied up with something else there. We are nice to see everyone.
Morven Robertson 10:35
That's.
Edward Baker 10:35
That's all right. I think you understand the purpose of the meeting and we're just, you know, John John's about to come in. But just giving thoughts initially to Morgan on whether or nota coordinator is needed and like where that coordinator might sit, but really it was, you know, what's needed now, but we'll hear from John.
And then come in if you want.
John Balls 10:58
Yeah. Good afternoon all. Hi, Morgan. How are you doing?
Morven Robertson 11:01
Yeah. OK. Thanks.
John Balls 11:02
Good. Yeah, a little bit there. What? Emmano said we're we're partly covered a little bit of that because we're now creating a well using the word loosely, a committee providing we're going to agree on the people who have already put their names down. In my eyes, I see it.
Morven Robertson 11:04
Yeah.
John Balls 11:21
The starting of a committee and that's the the nucleus of all we would then.
Hopefully put people in the forefront to represent, but whoever we get to represent that then comes back to the funding money. You can't expect somebody to say. Yeah, I'll do that road. I'll do that road Rd.
And all of a sudden, well, actually, how much am I doing this for? Why am I doing it? Who's Rep? Who am I representing it and answering the question which, you know, I said the other night, you know, we have people in North Devon who expect people to represent.
And don't want to pay anything, and as soon as anybody speaks a little bit out of line.
You know that they're the biggest problem ever put on a pair of shoes, but we have to start this if we're going to. If we're going to run this properly, we've got to start from the bottom. We've started from the bottom. We've got a few people together who are prepared.
To be the nucleus and the fund and money which we're being offered is there. So are we going to then? Are we going to take the role of being the people who make the decisions? Are we going to advertise this role?
And who are we going to advertise it to? Do we go outside of the volume of people we have interested now? You know, that's beyond long. Bit above my pay grade. I I have no idea in some respects what we're.
I know what we'd like to achieve, but how can we achieve it?
Thank you.
Morven Robertson 13:11
Yeah, I think that's totally fair enough. And I think you know that's I guess why I want to unpack, I guess, what the need is, you know and if it's not a coordinator then is it someone to do a bit of that thinking around how does the governance of the group work? If there's a steering group or a committee.
Are they ultimately the people who make decisions? How does that work with members as they join? I mean, all of that kind of needs to be thought and worked out, doesn't it? But I think it needs someone helping the committee to do that work. So whether that's to start with a consultant to help you do that work with the intention of them maybe hiring.
Bring someone, but I think I don't know, John in terms of recruiting, but I would, I mean any any funding that Esme provides we ask any organisation that that role is fund is is publicly advertised because that kind of aligns with our fairness and transparency rules. So even if you had.
A candidate or a Fisher in mind, we would still want it to be advertised to everyone you know, to kind of in the interest of fairness. Yeah. But but I think what you said. Sorry, John, are you?
John Balls 14:18
Yeah, 100% agree with that.
Yeah. What one of the situations you're going to come up against, and I mean, I know the people who are in this neck of the woods, who would, who would? Who would I like to have represent me. I'll be honest with you.
There's probably one or two people who I could say, yeah, I'll trust their voice, but I know the next question they would ask, well, if I'm going to do, say, 10 or 15 hours a week, how much is that going to be worth to me? The unfortunate thing in this society.
We are a financially driven body. You you cannot get away from it. You know that every anybody will turn around and say to you. Well, you know, if I put my effort in, what am I going to get out of it myself?
Morven Robertson 15:08
Yeah.
Yeah, but I mean, I think that's why we're having this chat, isn't it? Azmi doesn't expect anyone to do this job for free. That's that's why we funded a similar coordinator for the Nature Friendly Farming Network who is paid. It is a paid role to do this coordination. So I think that's where.
John Balls 15:24
Yeah.
Morven Robertson 15:29
The group needs to think about what is the structure and what roles do you need and how much would you want those people to be paid and coming back to Emma's point, where do they sit? Because you know, many of the organisations on this call are a small size who, as you say.
Martin Yorwarth 15:33
Yeah.
Morven Robertson 15:48
And they're taking on a full time or a part-time person and employing them. That's a huge amount of risk and also management. So yeah, I think that's why the nature friendly farming network went with the RSPB because they did all of the back office work for them. You know, they paid the salary, they did the pension, they did everything, you know, and that person.
John Balls 16:01
Hmm.
Morven Robertson 16:08
Didn't work for the RSPB, but they were housed within that and that model works quite well in other we've done that with fauna and flora as well, who house the coastal communitiesnetwork so yeah.
John Balls 16:20
Yeah, the guy from the farm and family. He was his name. Mike, I think. Who spoke of Burgcade walk?
Morven Robertson 16:29
Yeah, Martin.
John Balls 16:30
Martin. Yeah. So he spoke very well. But you know what I remember there? That took them a long while to actually get off the ground.
Morven Robertson 16:39
Yeah, it did, but it started with them just paying someone part time to do all of this, thinking to listen to all of your ideas and get it into a structure to say we think we want to do these activities, we want our governance to be run in this way. This is how we make decisions. These are the things we're offering to people. You know, these are the main.
John Balls 16:49
Yeah, yeah.
Morven Robertson 16:59
And things we care about, you know? Yeah.
John Balls 17:04
Thank you.
Morven Robertson 17:08
Emma, maybe. And then Nicola, Nicola, you've had your hand up for a while, Nicola. Emma's still making her cheese sandwich.
Nicola White 17:15
I'm appointing. I'm appointing at me there. Yeah. I think a lot of what Ed has going to be sending out and the questionnaire rounds up a lot of how the network, the people in the network would feed into what they feel about committee and.
The steering group and that sort of thing. And I think that there weren't questions specifically about the the role, but there was, should somebody be doing the role of organising it? I it's whether it's chicken or egg, isn't it because you could?
Having the people's feedback from the network would be really useful as how they wanted it to feel, but also it might need the steering group to write some a protocol of some sort about what's wanted to be achieved, by whom and what sort of timeline anything might be on.
And then see if the network are happy with it and then advertise that role because you'll know what that role is going to be doing. That's which way around you do it, isn't it? As Emma said, take take your time and do it properly rather than advertise a role that you don't necessarily know what that role is going to be yet.
Morven Robertson 18:10
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah. Well, and you couldn't advertise it until you had funding for it as well. So and and in order to have funding for it, we'll need to figure out where it sits, IE which organisation is it going to be? Is that person going to be employed with and everyone's going to have to be happy with that. Yeah, absolutely.
Nicola White 18:22
But.
Morven Robertson 18:35
Yeah.
Emma Plotnek 18:39
Yeah, I. And on what Nicola said, I would be very happy. We've got like loads of terms of references that I would be able to like, just even like I'd just be happy to sit and start like hashing out what kind of things. You know I'd suggest and then have that go as a round document.
So at least I think probably before securing the funding, we need to kind of define what the role what everyone wants the role to look like, like what would be useful. But I had a couple of things I was going to say to what John said, I wouldn't.
Underestimate the amount of people that are out there that don't need to be paid hundreds of thousands of pounds who love the fishing industry are passionate about, like supporting fishermen. God, Lord knows, like me and Morgan have said loads of times. Like oh, if I wasn't doing the job I was doing now, I'd like to do this kind of job. You know, it's a, it's a fascinating part of job.
Martin Yorwarth 19:28
Yeah.
Emma Plotnek 19:31
There's loads of people out there around the UK who would be really good at this.
And I don't think need to be like paid big business money because we just you know, we like the flexibility of this kind of work and we like the interactions and the meaningfulness of it. So I think I wouldn't like do a disservice and say that you can pay them very little money, but I think just like a standard salary is pretty good to.
To like think along the terms of that and the thing I was going to say about like where it needs to sit, I think it's really hard because I was kind of thinking like I don't think there's any bigger NGOs that the industry trusts enough at the moment or like enough people have trust in.
Morven Robertson 20:12
Aye.
Emma Plotnek 20:18
For it to sit with him.
Like, I guess RSPB did for the farmers, so it'd be really good to kind of hear from people what they think or who they would maybe suggest. And then I was thinking like outside of that, where could they sit like for me, it seems like if there wasn't distrust in the organisation of the NFFO for many small scale fishers.
That would be a really good place for it to sit, but then I just there's too many people that distrust it and wouldn't.
Wouldn't want like the person sitting within that organisation. Yeah, it's really hard. I've like really been racking my brains. There's like, where this person could sit? I think possibly within a university is where I've like, come to try to think through, like, problem solve that, like, not thinking of any NGOs or.
Fishing organisations, where they would probably be neutral enough and maybe a university would be the right place, but I was just going to throw that out there because I'll keep thinking about it, but I don't know if I'll get to enhance that.
Morven Robertson 21:24
Carrie.
Jeremy Percy 21:26
I think Martin was before me. Yeah, Warren.
Morven Robertson 21:28
Baby.
Martin Yorwarth 21:31
All I'd like to say is I think there's a desperate need for this and one person this the fishing industry, is in such a mess, one person isn't enough. It needs a team. I've been quite busy organising the southeast and.
You know if if we hang on too much longer, we're going to lose the industry and it needs to be a grassroots person. Not, not not someone from a university. It needs to be someone that knows the fishing industry very well. Thank you.
Morven Robertson 22:04
Yeah. Well, thanks, Martin. And I think what I was trying to say was it almost where it's housed is it has to be accepted by fishers, but it's almost irrelevant that organisation that houses it. They're just there to do the financial back office support this person, I think, will agreed, needs to have fishing or.
Very close.
Related fishing experience and be someone everyone can like trust in. So I think you know that's coming across clear something as well just to flag is that you know I think someone said would we just get some funding for kind of four months or six months. I think that's too short. So if it gives you comfort from an Esme side, I don't think there's any point in hiring someone unless we give them at least.
Months to go away and like, try and do something with this, because even having conversations with fishers and getting them on side will take a minimum of maybe six months to a year. So you know and they've got to do some pre work before that to figure out how all of this works. So if it's useful to help with your planning of what it is, who it is.
Is and what it looks like? I think as we would be open to, you know, a grant of kind of 18 months plus to kind of for that person. I think it just for us comes back to making sure that wherever they were going to sit, the organisation that would be hired for that was a solid organisation with healthy finances, etcetera. But we can cross.
That bridge, when we come up with that organisation, I mean, it'd be great if it's someone neutral and they're like seafarers or fishmongers. I don't know if they'd ever do something like this. I don't know. But yeah, Jerry. And then Richard.
Jeremy Percy 23:34
Hi. Yeah. Sorry. Apologies again and I missed the last meeting because we had power cuts and no Internet or a bit of a quandary with me. To be honest. I mean, I've been very clear in my view that we missed a window serious window after the first two workshops and we're fourteen months or whatever it is down the line and we're still sitting here talking.
Martin Yorwarth 23:34
Yeah.
Jeremy Percy 23:54
And all the time, every day we're losing votes. And I just, you know, we're already at the ragged edge of that. So I'm always concerned when we're talking about. Oh, yes. But, you know, next year or the year after 18 months or whatever, I do think there is an urgent need. But that having said that.
Martin Yorwarth 24:06
I.
Jeremy Percy 24:11
And has been made very clear by a number of speakers today you get 2 fishermen in the room, you get at least three opinions and you know, if it's. If it's Fred, then Joe doesn't like Fred. And if it's Nicola, it's Nicola, Nicola. But you know what I mean. It's you're never going to get it. So. And I think there's a significantly different roles that we're discussing. On the one hand.
Martin Yorwarth 24:24
Yeah.
Yeah.
Jeremy Percy 24:30
And we're talking about someone getting the thing up and running, talking to fishermen don't. So just on and so forth, that's not necessary. You know, we're calling it a coordinator. It's not necessarily the person at the end of the day, we need sat in front of Defra making our case and pleading our case, etcetera. And I think that needs to be taken into consideration.
Martin Yorwarth 24:37
Yeah.
Jeremy Percy 24:47
But I think the key point I want to make is that your suggestion about perhaps a A consultant and especially an independent consultant, preferably someone from outside the industry, because as as John and others have said, you know, the lack of trust and the the the frankly the naivety of of many people you know we don't like this. We don't like that I think.
We need to, if we're going to get all our duction in a row, answer all the questions that have been thrown up in the last half an hour or so, and I think really we need an independent consultant paid a fee and not a huge fee, but a sensible fee to be able to get the nuts and bolts together. You know, I mean, it's been doing a grand job, but even he will admit, well, maybe you won't it.
Morven Robertson 25:10
It's.
Martin Yorwarth 25:11
Yeah.
Jeremy Percy 25:27
But you know, there are tensions. There are tensions between fishing and I talk, you know, I've got the start scars to prove it. I've also got the scars to prove. I worked voluntarily for two years. So let's not talk about money. But I do think that we need if we're going to get the structure right.
Then, as a first stage then I think if if with the greatest respect you get, you know, I do like the old phrase that the camel is a horse designed by committee. You know, you get this sort of. I can just imagine the conversations and the you know the the gossip and the backlighting and everything else. And I do think an independent person.
And wherever they may be based, going around, talking to fishermen, talking to ourselves, talking to others, getting the whole structure of the thing as right as we can in a short a time frame as we can, I think will be absolutely key because you're never going to get complete agreement, you will inevitably get those people on the sidelines who will say you've done this.
Wrong that wrong. I don't like this. I'm not going to play that well, that's their problem because the other element, as I said right at the outset is that we already we're we're running much later than we need to be to do what we can for the insure sector. But we do need to get the structure as right as we can.
Morven Robertson 26:35
Of.
Jeremy Percy 26:39
If it's someone independent and outside of the normal circles, I think that might be quite healthy. There are a number of researchers that were that we can find them. There's some people linked to Newcastle University, Exeter University, both of whom I worked with before, who? Who can provide some advice on that. But I think if we get the structure right then then we move on to getting some.
Martin Yorwarth 26:54
Yeah.
Morven Robertson 26:55
I.
Jeremy Percy 26:59
Somebody to actually do the job longer term, that's my view. For what it's worth. Thanks.
Morven Robertson 27:05
Thanks. That's really helpful. What do other people think about that? I mean, you know, if that was something everyone wanted, you know, we could look at a shorter, you know, grant to to pay someone to do that with all of you and then look for that person and you all to build a longer, you know, bid essentially.
With the foundation and any other funders that are interested, hopefully other people will want to. But yeah, just keen on views on that.
I don't know who's next. It's re all renumbering it all the time, but I think it was you, Richard. Were you? You too.
Richard Stride 27:36
Yeah, it's Martin.
Edward Baker 27:37
Does it?
But.
Richard Stride 27:39
Yeah. No, I I did because I while I'm holding on to the point that I put my hand up for go gowith Martin.
Morven Robertson 27:44
OK, fine, we'll hold that.
Edward Baker 27:44
No, no. I'd say say that point first, Richard.
Morven Robertson 27:47
Yeah.
Edward Baker 27:48
Go back to your first point and then.
Richard Stride 27:49
None.
OK. So just thinking back to what Emma said earlier about fishing into the future, not being an advocacy organisation and maybe, you know, wouldn't feel comfortable with hosting.
An organisation whose role is going to be campaigning and advocacy. I was just wondering whether it helps to look on that hosting as just a service and and I was also wondering how much the hosting organisation would be apparent.
Martin Yorwarth 28:06
Yeah.
Richard Stride 28:25
On the outside. So in other words, how apparent was it that RSPB was hosting a coordinator for the Nature friendly farming network at the time?
Martin Yorwarth 28:31
I'm.
Morven Robertson 28:34
Yeah.
Yeah.
I think that's a question for Martin, who will remember, I think, but they're not. I don't think they were like billed as a partner or a collaborator or anything. They were simply hiring the person and that person was completely managed by a group of farmers.
In a steering group with a governance structure and and reported to them, you know and did their work to the job spec that they had, they just simply were hired so that they could have their pay and pension done through an organisation that was capable of doing that.
That's all they're there to do. It's like fiscal hosting, essentially, that's all it is, you know? Yeah.
Richard Stride 29:17
So there would be an element in there to remunerate remunerate them for that as well.
Morven Robertson 29:17
Yeah.
Yeah. Well, yeah, I guess they would have to, you know, have a little bit of overhead cost in there. But I imagine it wouldn't be that much, you know. But as we all know, as we all know, say for example, you said, OK, Greenpeace, can you hire this person who doesn't even sit in your office, but you're going to pay their salary?
Richard Stride 29:39
None.
Morven Robertson 29:42
Every month and you won't actually talk to them. They're they're doing a totally different job. They're simply just on your payroll, you know, that will be in fishing news next week with everyone saying Greenpeace, puppeteering small scale fishermen network. So that's that's. That's the kind of like, I think we've got to be smart about where this person sits so that it doesn't go down in flames day one.
Richard Stride 29:53
Yeah.
Morven Robertson 30:03
Yeah, it's really tricky, yeah.
Richard Stride 30:05
OK. Thank you.
Morven Robertson 30:08
And so Martin, it's you, I think. And then Emma.
Martin Yorwarth 30:12
All I can say on it, I've put a small presentation together and you're willing to look at it at the end if you want to, but.
Morven Robertson 30:33
Is it?
Martin Yorwarth 30:33
Control of fishermen through their organisations and they're not being heard. So what we need to do is go around the back of these organisations and talk to real fishermen on the ground and I've been doing that over the last few weeks and I've put a small report together if you're interested in looking at it.
Morven Robertson 30:52
Yeah, that sounds interesting. I think obviously or if the network gets up and running, I guess it will be trying to do all those kinds of projects, won't it, you know, and and that's the kind of getting down the line into what what they would do and deliver, yeah.
Martin Yorwarth 31:00
I.
Morven Robertson 31:09
Emma.
Emma Plotnek 31:12
Yeah, I was just going to say on on the, I don't think it's a bad idea to potentially look at bringing someone who's just good at mobilising stuff because we're all like I didn't. We've all kind of offered our help and I know Ed's doing loads, but I think it needs someone a few days a week on getting this kind of moving and that necessary doesn't need to be.
Morven Robertson 31:23
Yeah.
Yeah.
Emma Plotnek 31:31
Could be the coordinator, it could just be someone that we know who works in fisheries, who understands the landscape, who's got a bit of time at the moment, who might be able to just, like, push things ahead. And then I had an absolutely, potentially mad idea. But could this person as a bit of recipe.
Prosity sit in the nature friendly farming network as a fish, a fishing person who could potentially talk to them and learn from them about what they did. But they could be a fishing person that eventually.
Morven Robertson 31:54
Yeah, maybe actually.
Emma Plotnek 32:06
You know creates a different organisation or because then for an amount of time they could just sit in there. That could be a really you've obviously got connections with them. I have no idea at the size of their organisation what they do but.
Morven Robertson 32:16
So yeah, that's a really good idea, Ed. I mean, I'm happy to have that chat with Martin or you could, depending on what your thoughts are on that, I mean that would be neutral and you get a lot of learning that way. I don't know how. Yeah, the question to them would be, can you take someone on and what does that look like?
Like for you? Yeah. And what? What would you need? Yeah.
Martin Yorwarth 32:37
Oh.
Emma Plotnek 32:40
Yes.
Edward Baker 32:40
I I think it's a brilliant. Yeah, I love the idea. I think there's a difference also between hiring a contractor and employing someone as well.
Morven Robertson 32:43
It's a good idea.
Edward Baker 32:53
As like you know, you employ someone and they're on your books and they've got holiday pay etcetera or you or you're just an organisation that for like hires a contractor and money goes to passes through them. So obviously a lot in my mind you just hire them as a as an independent contractor rather than an employee if you want to make.
It's super easy, but I I will gladly ask Martin on Monday next week if that's something that he could do.
Morven Robertson 33:19
OK.
Edward Baker 33:25
In response to, like so, Jerry was saying, you've got the potential two roles, the kind of person that builds it and then the person that sits in front of Defra. That's how I see it as well. There is a need for someone to.
Be actively recruiting and talking to fishermen and understanding what it is they need and how they want this to work and then swiftly moving into delivering some kind of action. And the only thing that I.
Morven Robertson 33:48
Yeah.
So.
That's enough.
Edward Baker 33:57
I'm nervous about is employing someone who isn't, we said at the beginning isn't already trusted and known to do either of those roles, so as much as you could employ an academic or a contractor to just coordinate.
Morven Robertson 33:59
So.
Edward Baker 34:13
I would worry that so and so with perhaps a university e-mail or just so and so from how recruit how Marine Consulting wouldn't.
Morven Robertson 34:18
Uh.
Edward Baker 34:24
Wouldn't sit right with the like the small scale fisherman in in the far-flung port, even though they might be great at organising.
Morven Robertson 34:25
But.
Yeah.
Yeah, but.
I may be misunderstood though. I thought what Jerry was saying was instead of hiring a coordinator and maybe a public affairs person straight off the bat, we do a pre phase which is working with a consultant to take all of your ideas and other ideas. Fishers inside outside the network.
Martin Yorwarth 34:35
Yeah.
Edward Baker 34:49
Yeah, and.
Morven Robertson 34:52
And put that into some form of plan that says this is what the organisation is. Yeah. And then so that person is not really working for the well, it's working to the steering group in quite a kind of closed project basis, you know.
Edward Baker 34:55
Yeah. No, no.
Hmm.
My concern is that that that role involves quite a lot of communication with fishermen and sort of recruiting that would put people off if it wasn't someone that was already trusted.
Morven Robertson 35:12
Hmm.
Hmm.
Edward Baker 35:21
'Cause. Then it's just like another consultant hired by the MMO to to do something. You know, that's how I that's kind of how I see it, but.
Morven Robertson 35:28
Yeah.
Who is trusted, though, by everyone who's who? Is that?
Edward Baker 35:32
Umm.
Well, you'd have to. You'd it would have to be as you say, it would have to be externally advertised. Similarly, you'd just. You'd have like, if you had an idea of to what consultancy you wanted to run it through, they would have to reply to an external advert.
And as Emma just said, there's lots of people out there who might be willing. I'm, like, off the top of my head. I don't know who they are.
Morven Robertson 35:55
Hmm.
OK.
Edward Baker 35:58
But I I yeah, the by fisherman. For fisherman. I think. I think we lose if you employ someone who is not already, like at least acknowledged, you know.
Morven Robertson 36:07
Yes.
Edward Baker 36:10
I might be wrong. Yeah, I'm happy to, depending on how.
Morven Robertson 36:12
Even for the pre bit to figure out a governance structure, I totally agree with the coordinator bit. Yeah, but.
Edward Baker 36:20
It depends how much work that that that pre bit involves communicating with a wider potential network, because if you if that person has to go out and speak to fishermen to ask them what they want, they are effectively recruiting. But if that person is really just talking to a smaller core of steering group that accepts them.
Morven Robertson 36:28
Hmm.
Edward Baker 36:39
And that's then that's OK, but you want a wider. I'm sure you'd want a wider canvas.
Morven Robertson 36:41
Hmm.
Edward Baker 36:46
Lots of people with hands up.
Jeremy Percy 36:49
Yes. So it's in my turn, Morgan.
Edward Baker 36:52
Yeah.
Morven Robertson 36:53
Yeah. Just go. Go for it. I don't wanna. Yeah.
Jeremy Percy 36:54
Yeah. So, no, I I I do like to be structured in these things, otherwise everyone keeps.
So yeah, thanks for all that. I mean, I do think, yeah, just to be absolutely clear, I don't Christ, if we learn one thing is to you, who do you find trustworthy within the industry because there's there's so many factions in shore, offshore, big, small. And even within those, there are differences of opinion. So just for me to be clear what I'm suggesting.
Is because you know we're having these conversations. We're no further forward really in terms of an overarching structure and the feedings etcetera. I can assure you there are no sure there will be no shortage of issues that this, this organisation and the final.
Person or whatever you want to call him or her will be involved in. I speak from some experience in that, so that's not particularly a problem I think, but we're we we much as I want to get on with things, I don't think we can run before we can walk and just from these conversations we're very obviously not clear about the structure that that, that.
The the communication there was etcetera. So I think as a first step we need to get somebody in, preferably independent, but we'll see because we'll have to have to. I'm just easy. I mean there's any number of examples of people that come to my mind. I'm not sure whether I should suggest them or not.
But there are some good people out with the industry, but with a very good understanding of the industry. Who would be able to do this sort of service that I'm I'm suggesting as an initial step. And from your perspective more than I would have thought that Esme would want to have a very clear.
Structure here about steps going forward and I don't think I think if we try and run before we can walk, we could just fall over ourselves. So getting an initial structure you you don't need to go out and talk to every fisherman in the world what you know there is the Internet, we can do surveys, we can get information in. I think people will need to go out and talk physically perhaps to this steering group and a few.
To others and then you can you can ask more generally, but I do think as a key first step get somebody in, get a structure in place, you're never going to get 100% agreement, but at least you know if you've don't spoken to sufficient people and you've had sufficient feed in that, you can come up with a sensible structure.
Then I think people will criticise it. Christ, they will always do that. But then we can move forward because you're then talking about, you know, perhaps 1 or maybe 2 steps. You know, maybe maybe a coordinator, maybe a final, whatever you want to call them. But the first thing and the key thing in my view at this stage is to get a structure in place.
Thank you.
Morven Robertson 39:36
Thank you.
Edward Baker 39:40
John.
Morven Robertson 39:41
I love to, Tonya.
John Balls 39:42
Yeah. Just coming in there. What Jerry has now said is right. He's got first hand experience with, not for. So he knows the pitfalls. We don't he he he will obviously openly admit we don't want this group to be Todd with sorry Jerry. But Todd, with the not for bro.
Can't get away from that as soon as your name. As mentioned, Jerry, that will happen. But we all know, I mean we're we're sitting looking at the realistically the steering group committee. Call it what you like. We are that group. The people who's on this group here know are the is the steering group.
And I think, I mean, I've ran my own business ever since I left school in 75, but I don't know the intricate insurance and outs of how you bring people together to a certain degree and then start, you know, I can talk with people from deaf or I can talk with Anne Freeman.
I can talk with the, you know, micro. I can talk with people like that, but there has to be a structure. What we are looking at now on I made a couple of notes and for us for this group to move forward.
This group what we have here now, we need to have somebody because if we're going to start making a difference to the fisheries, whether it's inshore or we represent our offshore colleagues, we have got to be able to have.
Martin Yorwarth 41:11
Yeah.
John Balls 41:13
Confidence in the person who is going to go to people like death for the MMO or starting blocks on the inshore fishery of the iffkas. We have to have someone capable and competent who can speak directly to these people with the concerns and Dr forward.
Would.
Relevant fisheries. You know, we we have to start moving, otherwise we're just going to be bogged down and going round and round in circles. Thank you.
Jeremy Percy 41:43
Yeah. So if I I hate to **** in, but yes, just I think as I say, we don't want to. It's important you get the structure because you can't have someone if you have someone stood in front of Defra, then the first complaint people are going to make, well, they didn't ask me, you know, so you have to have a structure in place to start with and and just the other point.
Martin Yorwarth 41:50
It.
Jeremy Percy 42:02
I might make is I sit on the steering group, reluctantly, to be honest, but there is no way in the world I'm going to get involved any further than that. So don't for a moment think, John, that any of this is not for Mark to God. Help me know I've done my bit for queen and country.
Morven Robertson 42:13
Yes.
John Balls 42:13
No, I I understand that. But I was just using that as a as a like a reference as such.
Jeremy Percy 42:20
Yeah, yeah. But you could say that about a lot of people, John. Everyone. I just want the points I made about having someone potentially external or at least linked because everyone has baggage in this business. Everybody, you know, you talk to one person, you know, you know, so, yeah, thanks. Sorry about them.
John Balls 42:31
Yeah. Oh, so oh, lightly agree.
Thank you.
Edward Baker 42:37
Mine.
Martin Yorwarth 42:39
Yeah, I can back up what Ed said there. I think it needs to be someone from the fishing industry that fishermen trust. If you're going to have an academic go around, no one's going to be interested. I am a fisherman. They're just going to shut off. I mean, the fishing industry is in such a mess.
My boat's tied up with OMCA.
And there's many happening like this boats just being tied up, the fisheries shutting down. Sothe longer we talk about it, the more fishermen we're going to lose. That's why over the last month, I've actually been going boots on ground talking to fishermen.
Spoken to probably 60 or 70 fishermen in the southeast. So in the southeast we're organising pretty fast whether there's funding or not.
Morven Robertson 43:25
Yeah. And as I said, you know, like else me is we're loved by what you guys want to do. You know if you need money tomorrow and you're all comfortable with that, we can like move that forward as quickly as we can. If you say we need six months to figure out the structurethen that's cool too. But we clearly.
Edward Baker 43:26
The.
Morven Robertson 43:44
In order to move forward in any shape or form, whether that's some short term funding to give you some capacity to figure out who you are and what you do and where you sit, or if that's a longer term, ask we will need you to be able to articulate that in a kind of cohesive and unified way. So yeah, it's kind of up. It's totally up to you and you know.
Martin Yorwarth 43:50
Yeah.
Morven Robertson 44:04
I guess I'm. I guess it does sound like we need to maybe reflect and figure out if this is like we just need some short term funding to get some capacity and to put a plan together and have those conversations with the nature for any farming network. Have those conversations on the structure, you know, what are the roles, what do they do?
Martin Yorwarth 44:04
OK.
Morven Robertson 44:23
Do you know what are we asked? What do we want? Like, that's totally fine. If it's, if it's a shorter piece of funding that's needed, or if it's a longer one, you know? But you know, as a funder, we can't take that forward until you've all decided that and feel comfortable with that. And we're we're not. You're not.
Not pressuring you to do that. It's also cool if you turn around and say we don't need any money, you know that's cool too. So yeah.
Martin Yorwarth 44:45
Yeah, I can just just come in there again. So what's founded in the South? What's funding it in the Southeast is my house.
Jeremy Percy 44:45
We need money. Let's be very clear. We need money.
Morven Robertson 44:47
Yeah. Yeah. I'm, I'm.
Yeah.
Martin Yorwarth 44:56
That's what's found in it here.
Edward Baker 44:59
So I think we've got general agreement that we do need some kind of you need a coordinator to organise the structure. I've I've drafted the survey that I've said I will send out to everyone that's signed up so far that asks initial questions on structure.
Morven Robertson 45:10
Please.
Edward Baker 45:17
And in that survey, it says voluntarily organised steering group that are going to stay in place until, like I've said, roughly 3 months and then they will be voted on going forward by the organisation. And I've said is that a yet like do you agree to this?
So and that's not gone out yet, but what I'd like to get from like the next 10 minutes is are, are we happy that this survey still goes out if we are then kind of recapitulating and saying that we need to employ somebody to look at the structure?
Or, you know, you send a survey out, you get loads of responses, and then you bring someone else in to to look at the structure and they throw out what came back on the survey. I. But what I what I'm going to suggest is that we include in the survey the question that Jerry, you know.
Martin Yorwarth 45:57
Yeah.
Edward Baker 46:10
We think 2 roles are needed. One is an initial coordinator to set up the structure the the other is a more long term pace. Do you agree? Yes or no comments and then and then take it from there. Once we've got this survey back that gives us an indication as to what the rest of the Group One and gives them the opportunity.
To sort of to accept that we are the steering group for the next three months before it gets voted in and then at least we have, like we have a level of progress from this evening's meeting. And if we, you know, I'd say that that survey could be like in before Christmas and then like very early January, it's.
Martin Yorwarth 46:30
Yeah.
Edward Baker 46:49
Assessed and we can go to Morgan and go. Yeah, like the membership thing. This we definitely need a coordinator. We need them for six months. They're except. That's roughly how I see this.
Emma.
John Balls 47:02
I fully agree with that, Ed, what you've now said there makes positive sense and I think this is the road that we've got to go down to get this off the ground. Sorry about jumping in there, Emma.
Emma Plotnek 47:14
All right. Again, he goes to me outside, John or.
Edward Baker 47:15
Thanks John.
Emma Plotnek 47:21
He's done.
Edward Baker 47:21
Go, Emma.
John Balls 47:22
I I then I then put the hand up and say carry on, but I realised I ain't got no camera. Carry on.
Emma Plotnek 47:29
Right. Yeah, I think I'm, I would be a bit cautious about asking too many like really specific logistical questions to the whole group and I don't know if I'm doing a disservice to everyone, but I think that.
We need to kind of gather.
Kind of a bit of a bigger, broader idea about how it should function, because actually what that looks like, so sometimes I unmute myself and I'm not entirely sure I'm going with the conversation. But like I I think it needs to.
It it might not be best to ask everyone because they actually might not have a good idea exactly what it should look like, especially to the extent of like everyone on this group that's hashing it out. But it'd be really good to know kind of what they they want from.
I guess, yeah. What they want from the network, but what I was really immuning to say was something I've completely forgotten now. So keep talking enough. Put my hands up again. When I remember it.
Morven Robertson 48:31
You mean you would rather people be asked? What do you want a network to do rather than what is the structure of the governance structure of a network and the resourcing framework that sits under that? Yeah, yeah.
Emma Plotnek 48:43
Yeah.
Knowing that we just like a whole day with the part, the Director of social change who are like governance experts, just trying to figure out our way forward at fishing into the future. Like you can't just ask someone who doesn't understand.
Martin Yorwarth 48:45
OK.
Emma Plotnek 48:59
First of all, like governance, quite clearly and structures of organisation and structures of organisation and governance is not the expertise of, like many fishermen and the fishermen in the room. When we did that conversation when we had that conversation, Ed was there. We'll know that they go. I don't understand any of this. This isn't my area of expertise so.
Figuring out governance, we like the network will have to buy in that expertise, like how to structure things. The network needs to buy in that. And I have remembered what I was going to like.
Jeremy Percy 49:23
Watch.
Morven Robertson 49:26
Yeah.
Jeremy Percy 49:27
Yeah, I think that's just what I said.
Morven Robertson 49:29
But I think that's what Jerry was saying. So I think actually, Ed, I I still not sure we're summarising the hour in at least in the way that I had understood it. So it sounds like we want to eventually sometime in the next year higher.
Emma Plotnek 49:29
Yeah.
Morven Robertson 49:47
One member or two members of staff, a coordinator who focuses down on fissures and their needs, and someone who maybe sits in Westminster banging the drum, advocating for improved policy that meets their needs. But it sounds like Joey was saying there is a pre phase that maybe sits.
Between this questionnaire and hiring people that has experience of building a governance structure that is fit for purpose, for what this network wants to be and figures out how everyone makes decisions and sits within that like a an organogram basically very unsexy.
And then also figures out what organisation can house this and gets that sorted, because that's the bit I'm hearing. We don't have capacity to do right now and need someone who actually knows how to figure out what what kind of entity is this network and where does it.
Legally, sit with another organisation and what is the relationship with that or the housed organisation? And then yeah, that's. Is that right, Jerry? Sorry. I'm just trying to.
Yeah.
Jeremy Percy 50:53
Sorry, Adrian. Yeah. I mean, yes, absolutely. I do think I'm concerned. I mean, Emery's just really supported what I was saying is that with the greatest respect, you're not going to find very many governance experts in the fishing sector, especially the inshore sector for very obvious reasons. So the first stage and I use the word consultant, I don't like the word consultant, but it's somebody.
Morven Robertson 50:59
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
MMM.
Jeremy Percy 51:12
With the knowledge of governance structures and hopefully with an understanding of the fishing industry, God help them to set up the foundation because without the foundation and the foundation to an extent is separate from what fishermen want, the the, the getting our structure.
Right. And they don't have input from fishermen, of course, but generally speaking you want. You know, I found in in the past that somebody external from whatever you're dealing with is quite valuable because they don't come with any bandage baggage. So I think an interim short term setting up the structure that you know and some people won't like.
Martin Yorwarth 51:32
Yeah.
Jeremy Percy 51:52
Like it? But if it's a effective governance structure, then they can argue until the cows come. It doesn't matter because it will be a nice solid structure which will reinforce or reassure people like you, Morgan and your people to to to support it going forward. So yes, in in a nutshell, one step at a time.
Get the structure right and then move to coordinator representative whatever you want to call them, but until we get the structure right and get the feed in where we will inevitably care, I don't think we it would be unsafe to move further forward than that. Thank you. Sorry Adrian.
Morven Robertson 52:24
Yeah.
Edward Baker 52:25
Lady, go on. You're on mute.
Adrian Bartlett 52:33
Yeah, and all I was going to say is back, back, it's the back head up here.
I think we need to get that survey out. I filled it out and sent it back in. I think we certainly need to try to get some direction, but it's apparent that we are hanging on here, weren't we? And we've just got to have a leap of faith in a minute.
That somebody can go and work alongside Ed, take pressure away from Ed and the pfsa over all this. If even if that is just trying to work alongside him for three months, let's get the word out there. Let's get on the ground. Let's get on the Internet. Let's get the interest.
Going, you know, ever since I've been connected to the insure network, there's only this. It's unfortunately the same faces that can make the meetings. John was saying. I think you're looking at the steering group and there could be a few more on the outside that could be busy tonight, but I think I think we've got to just.
Get going. You know, somehow, if it's an interim bit of funding for somebody to come in, you know, I'm agreeance with everybody else. It's got to have somebody that's non biassed and transparent within the industry very far and few between, but they are out there.
Does it go? Does it stay internal for a minute or two until we can get it up and running and then go external? Is that a way of doing it, you know, and I'll go back to fishing to the future. I've been connected to it and not so much now, but I've been connected to it for a long time and that was years to get.
Morven Robertson 54:02
Thank you all.
Adrian Bartlett 54:08
Where fishing in the future sits in the industry and it sits in the industry brilliantly well now. But you know, I'm just saying we need to somehow more than to get going and support aired over the next three or four months to get the structure in place.
Martin Yorwarth 54:14
Yeah.
Adrian Bartlett 54:23
And everything in places it's going to be difficult the way we're carrying on. It's going to be difficult to do that as as we sit here really.
Morven Robertson 54:29
Yeah, that's not a problem. Like, please don't leave this call without thinking, like as me is completely behind this, we want it to work and we want you to be resourced properly, but you need to be able to articulate to us what is it. You know, how much is it over how many months and what's it going towards. And you know, for us to have confidence that you as a steering group.
We're all agreed on that, you know, so whatever it is, a short time, a short time, ask or something longer. It doesn't matter what it is. It just needs to have a bit of a plan behind it. But yeah, you know.
Adrian Bartlett 54:53
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think you're right. Sorry. I'm getting bitten by a puppy. That's I'm not cringing, just getting bitten by. But you're right. I think we need. There's two, two ways of looking at this. I know we're running out of time. I think we need a short period of interim of support.
Morven Robertson 55:05
That's fine. That's fine. Yeah, it. Yeah.
Adrian Bartlett 55:15
Over the network, you know supporting Ed and supporting where we are get the interest going, get social media going and then that a link in naturally then to the structure to where we want it guided. You know if it's external or internal.
For for sending out an, you know the invitation to somebody for running this. Jerry's right. We're going to need somebody with a very political head on that can stand in front of those rooms in front of those people to say it right. But I think we just need to take this to the next step now.
Just to try to get, you know somebody can concentrate on it one or two days a week and just really plough on with it. If you see what I mean and that's that's that's kind of my views at the moment. Cheers.
Morven Robertson 55:59
Yeah.
OK.
Edward Baker 56:03
Is everyone alright to stay on for 5 minutes?
Jeremy Percy 56:06
Only fine. I've got a council on for my sins on the town council so.
Edward Baker 56:08
Yeah, no. All right, Nick, Nicola.
Morven Robertson 56:08
Yeah, 5 minutes, yeah.
John Balls 56:10
Yeah, fine, fine.
Edward Baker 56:12
Nicola.
Martin Yorwarth 56:14
Play song.
Nicola White 56:15
Sorry, yeah, I've just made a couple of notes there. Going back through the conversation. One was somebody like Molly. Sorry, it's a boober going in the background. Somebody like Molly, who's been doing the socio economic questionnaires. I'm just wondering whether that sort of person might be suitable, but also thinking about the work that Ed's already done for the.
Questionnaires. Is it worth maybe to get the ball rolling to get that out with some push through social network things? Caveat on that to say that this is a starting point we can work with the answers that come back in off that to create the body.
That works its way forward and maybe a danger it being far too wide a question, sort of. What do you, as members of the network want us to do? How do you want us to take things forward? But that could be opening a massive can of worms because it's too much of an open question that needs to have closed questions in it.
Yeah.
Edward Baker 57:11
Thanks, Nicola. I'll just come in. So what I want from the next 5 minutes is like are we sending the survey out? I think it's pretty broad, but I and I also want confirmation that I think we're all agreeing, we need an interim coordinator to set up the structure and that's the message that goes out to the network.
Martin.
Martin Yorwarth 57:32
Just like to say I would be willing to work for nothing to go and give these forms out and these surveys out and to speak to fishermen are definitely in the southeast. Anyway, my boats tied up with OMCA. I'm not fishing.
Morven Robertson 57:37
Yeah.
Martin Yorwarth 57:49
I've got a passion for the industry and a commitment a 30 year commitment to the industry, so I'm already I'm already going around putting these forms around in the southeast, so if I'm offering my services.
Edward Baker 58:03
Thanks, Martin. Appreciate it, Richard.
Richard Stride 58:07
Yeah, I think you should put the survey out, but as Nicola was saying, you know, frame it as a call for call for ideas rather than like a referendum. We're not, you know, I was conscious when I was filling it in and I know I haven't sent it to you yet because I got stuck on a point and I.
Again, I I was conscious of the fact that I wouldn't want what I was thinking at the time just to suddenly become the structure without it being thoroughly kicked about. And so I think, and also I was very conscious that, you know, my experience, whatever it is, is still going to be limited compared with, you know, what the latest thinking might might be on.
Martin Yorwarth 58:45
Yeah.
Richard Stride 58:47
On governance. So yeah, if I, I'm happy to make a contribution to that through the survey and I'm sure a lot of people will and a lot of people would just want to join an organisation that's all ready running, you know, they just want to turn key project. They can, they can jump aboard.
Martin Yorwarth 58:58
Yeah.
Edward Baker 59:06
So are we happy that we carry out that survey with the interim steering group have decided that we need external help to properly structure this? This is a kick off survey and we're going to go away and look at how we can finance and what organisation can help us access that interim.
Morven Robertson 59:19
Yes.
Yeah.
Edward Baker 59:24
Consultant is that? Is that where we're at?
Jerry.
Martin Yorwarth 59:29
Yeah.
Jeremy Percy 59:29
Yeah, but I hope so. I'm, as I say, I'm danger of repeating myself here. I think the the, the whether you call it coordinator, I always, I always see three stages sort of a a an external or somebody related but not a fisherman.
Edward Baker 59:35
Yeah.
Jeremy Percy 59:45
To and with great respect to Martin, that's not what we're looking for, Mark. We're not talking about. We're looking at the governance, the structure. We're not looking at the sort of fishing industry more broadly at this stage. So you want to get a governance person, you know, in the past I've used sort of external business people who are very sharp at this sort of thing and they're not necessarily.
Official.
Say so we need to get that structure right, and that's almost external to what we're talking about now in terms of the broader consensus of fishermen, because the structure is a structure, there will be input to it, but they're getting the governance right. I think for mortgage benefit as much as ourselves is to ensure that's right. Then you've got someone to take that forward.
Martin Yorwarth 1:00:19
Yeah.
Jeremy Percy 1:00:25
But that's not necessarily the same person who's going to stand in front of Defra and etcetera. But I. But the point I'm making is we don't need to get that far ahead in our thinking. I think we we need to because you're going to get a lot of feedback from the from the questionnaires.
Edward Baker 1:00:30
Yeah. So look, I think.
Jeremy Percy 1:00:41
We need someone to do the structure, then we talk about the next step. It's very straightforward funding is there. That's just one step at a time. Guys, girls.
Edward Baker 1:00:45
Cool, yeah.
Got it. Thanks. Martin, you had your hand up.
No.
Yeah.
Martin Yorwarth 1:00:56
I've done this PowerPoint presence and if anyone wants to look at it.
Edward Baker 1:00:58
Are we?
Maybe. Maybe send it round by e-mail if that's the right mind. We're all ready, ready. Overrunning. Jerry said. He's gotta get somewhere.
Jeremy Percy 1:01:10
Yeah. OK, 6 minutes. Yeah.
Edward Baker 1:01:12
I think I think I think, yeah, we've got broad understanding that we need this interim stage and you're happy with the survey to go out with a few tweaks based on the comments I've got back and then we'll get back to more than probably early, early new year if not late December.
Jeremy Percy 1:01:27
Are you happy with that moving?
Morven Robertson 1:01:29
Yeah, that's great. I'm here waiting to receive whatever you'd like as me to consider support for, depending on how much money it is. If it's not going to be that much and it's short term, I can turn it around very quickly my side as long as I'm happy that you're all agreed and you want to do this and that we're clear on who's applying to us, if that's going to be PFSA for some rings, fence funding.
Jeremy Percy 1:01:32
Yeah.
Marvellous.
Yeah.
Morven Robertson 1:01:49
That's fine. So yeah, I'm here ready to support and hopefully take it forward. Can't speak for my trustees, but they're they're very keen to see this continue. So I just want to thank all of you for your time this evening. I'm really excited to see that there's some momentum building and just want to kind of echo as me and I'm sure other funders are here to kind of come in behind you and figure it out.
Jeremy Percy 1:01:50
OK.
No.
Morven Robertson 1:02:09
Along the way. So if there's anything we can support with, do let me know. You know, that's what we're here to do. So yeah. Thank you.
Jeremy Percy 1:02:14
Marvellous. Super news. I've got to go. Thanks so much. More than everybody else. Right. OK.
Morven Robertson 1:02:17
Yeah, I do as well. Thanks all. Bye bye. Bye bye.
Edward Baker 1:02:17
Bro.
Richard Stride 1:02:18
Yeah.
Edward Baker 1:02:19
Thank you very much. All right, same home.
Richard Stride 1:02:20
See you all. Take care. I'm looking for. Yeah. I want the recipe.
Jeremy Percy 1:02:21
Thanks guys. Cheers now bye bye bye.
Edward Baker stopped transcription